Navigating Divorce, Custody, and Complex Assets With Family Law Expert Brad Schweiger

July 3, 2024 | Written by Gladiator Law Marketing

Brad Schweiger is a seasoned attorney and a Partner at Richter & Phillips LLP, where he focuses on family law litigation. Holding a BS in psychology, Brad went on to earn his law degree from the University of Illinois Chicago School of Law. As an active member of the State Bar of Wisconsin, Illinois Bar Association, and Dane County Bar Association, Brad lends his expertise to several legal associations and programs, including the Dane County Family Law Attorneys Group. Additionally, he acts as a guardian ad litem and is a mediator with the Dane County Bar Case Mediation Program.

Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:

[1:29] Brad Schweiger shares how his psychology background helped his family law career
[2:40] How and when Brad knew he wanted to be a lawyer
[6:10] The importance of a personalized approach in family law
[7:53] How to handle property division issues
[9:49] Family law misconceptions and how to manage child custody disputes
[13:46] What inspired Brad to become a guardian ad litem?
[16:24] Ways to avoid getting overwhelmed when responding to emotionally charged legal issues
[18:15] The importance of gathering cold, hard facts in family law cases
[25:27] Brad’s advice to upcoming lawyers who want to pursue family law

In this episode…

Divorce and custody battles can be some of the most challenging and emotionally charged experiences attorneys can face. How can they navigate these difficult waters while also managing complex asset divisions and ensuring the best outcomes for families?

According to Brad Schweiger, a seasoned family law expert, understanding the intricacies of both the legal and emotional aspects of family law is crucial. He highlights the importance of starting with any agreements between parties and utilizing tools like mediation and guardian ad litems to resolve disputes amicably. Brad emphasizes that every case is unique, requiring a tailored approach to handle issues like property division and child custody effectively. He highlights the critical role of legal professionals in guiding clients through one of the most stressful periods of their lives.

In this episode of 15 Minutes, host Chad Franzen speaks with Brad Schweiger, Partner at Richter & Phillips LLP, to discuss navigating divorce, custody, and complex asset divisions. They explore common misconceptions in family law, the importance of understanding the emotional and legal challenges, and strategies for effectively managing high-stress cases.

Resources mentioned in this episode:

Special Mentions:

Quotable Moments:

“I think it’s really important to take appropriate breaks… if you feel yourself getting too emotionally invested, you need to put that file down.”
“This area of practice, and continuing to do it and having been doing it for 15 years now, so I must like something about it.”
“Once you do a couple of [guardian ad litem cases], it gives a litigator just a different perspective.”
“Just because your kid reaches a certain age doesn’t mean they get to decide [custody].”
“If you want a first chair trial real quick, come into family law.”

Action Steps:

Communication is key: Strengthening communication skills is crucial in both personal relationships and professional environments, preventing misunderstandings and creating harmonious interactions. Effective communication is the cornerstone of dealing with high-stress scenarios in family law.
Embrace empathy: Cultivate empathy towards clients to understand their situations better and provide tailored legal advice. Empathize with clients and guide them through difficult times in family law disputes.
Balance is essential: Ensure you maintain a balance between your career and personal life to avoid burnout and provide the best service. Balance is a key to success, especially when managing a demanding career in family law.
Continue learning: Stay updated with the latest developments in family law and participate in legal access and educational programs. Remaining current in the legal field through involvement in legal associations and educational programs keeps lawyers effective and informed.
Understand client narratives: Take the time to understand the client’s unique stories and emotional investments in property division or child custody. By acknowledging the significance of seemingly minor details, a family lawyer can provide more empathetic and effective counsel.

Sponsor for this episode…

This episode is brought to you by Gladiator Law Marketing, where we deliver tailor-made services to help you accomplish your objectives and maximize your growth potential.

To have a successful marketing campaign and make sure you’re getting the best ROI, your firm needs to have a better website and better content. At Gladiator Law Marketing, we use artificial intelligence, machine learning, and decades of experience to outperform the competition.

To learn more, go to gladiatorlawmarketing.com or schedule a free marketing consultation. You can also send an email to adam@gladiatorlawmarketing.com.

Episode Transcript

Intro 0:01

You’re listening to 15 Minutes where we feature community leaders sharing what the rest of us should know but likely don’t.

Chad Franzen 0:12

Hi. Chad Franzen here, one of the hosts of Share Your Voice, where we talk with top notch law firms and lawyers about what it takes to grow a successful law practice. This episode is brought to you by Gladiator Law Marketing, delivering tailor made services to help you accomplish your objectives and maximize your growth potential to have a successful marketing campaign and make sure you’re getting the best ROI your firm needs to have a better website and better content. Gladiator Law Marketing uses artificial intelligence, machine learning and decades of experience to outperform the competition to learn more. Go to gladiatorlawmarketing.com, where you can schedule a free marketing consultation. My guest today is Brad Schweiger, a Partner at Richter & Phillips LLP, focusing on family law, litigation, and mediation. Brad earned a Bachelor of Science in Psychology from the University of Wisconsin Whitewater and graduated from the University of Illinois, Chicago School of Law. He is a member of the State Bar of Wisconsin, Illinois Bar Association, and Dane County Bar Association. Brad is added in various legal associations and programs such as the Dane County Family Law Attorneys group and the Dane County Bar Case Mediation Program. Outside of work, he enjoys spending time with his family, playing soccer, hiking and traveling. Brad, great to have you here today. How are you?

Brad Schweiger 1:26

I’m doing well, Chad. Thanks for having me.

Chad Franzen 1:29

Yeah. Thank you. Hey, tell me if you could, as we get started, you majored in psychology when you were at Wisconsin. Scott, how has that helped you, if at all, in your legal career?

Brad Schweiger 1:43

I think especially in the area of family law, it helps tremendously. We often deal with people who are in crisis, or are dealing with a partner or a child who is in crisis, or having a mental health crisis, or just struggling not maybe it’s not even a crisis, and it gives a lot of insight into what they’re dealing with, and it helps me direct them to resources, especially in the area of family law, we do a lot of different things, and lots of times we have a team that that gets put together to help prepare a case. So having that background so you you know where to go and where to look to try to find people either either additional assistance that they need, or maybe they just need help managing the stress of a divorce, you have that that stepping stone in that background as well.

Chad Franzen 2:40

How and when did you know you wanted to become a lawyer?

Brad Schweiger 2:45

I wanted to be a lawyer when I was in high school, that was one of the couple of paths I was I was looking at. And then when I got to college, I was thinking psychology or law. And as I got closer and closer to graduation, I knew I wanted to do psychology lesser and less as a practice, and looked at the laws as something I wanted to do more seriously.

Chad Franzen 3:12

What was it about psychology that became less and less appealing?

Brad Schweiger 3:18

Probably the statistics.

Chad Franzen 3:21

Really. Yeah, I could see that. I could see that. So, so you, how did you kind of you, you went to law school. How did you kind of journey into the legal industry?

Brad Schweiger 3:32

Well, went to law school, and then I graduated in a in a down market, and ended up practicing family law. And really kind of just fell into it. That was not my aim to do family law, but then I took to it, and I just kind of stuck with it, and I really started to understand and appreciate that this area of practice, and continue to do it and and been doing it for 15 years now, so I must like something about it.

Chad Franzen 4:04

Yeah, yeah, that’s That’s great. So you graduated from school in Wisconsin. Did you editing in Illinois the entire time as an attorney? Or did you also work in Wisconsin?

Brad Schweiger 4:17

Yeah, I started my practice in Illinois. So I graduated law school in 2008 and then moved back to Wisconsin in 2011.

Chad Franzen 4:31

And what was the reason for them?

Brad Schweiger 4:34

The reason was my, my fiance at the time, postdoc.

Chad Franzen 4:40

What’s that? Say that again? Oh, postdoc.

Brad Schweiger 4:42

The reason was my fiance, my fiance at the time, my now wife, her postdoc, brought back to my native Wisconsin and and we put down roots here. So we’ve been here since 2011.

Chad Franzen 4:58

Okay, yeah, sounds good. Yeah, how do you balance your professional life with your personal interests as you as long as we’re talking about your wife.

Brad Schweiger 5:09

Yeah, my wife’s a full time professional as well. She’s a She’s a psychologist, and so they kind of dovetails into what I tell like clients or when I’m getting giving advice to people either going through divorce or maybe thinking about getting married. Just from a divorce attorney’s perspective, it’s a lot of communication and compromise, balancing work and spousal obligations, and we got two kids so, you know, running kids around and taking care of them and making sure that they’re getting to the things that they need to get to, um, and I think there’s, it’s a, it’s a constant renegotiation.

Chad Franzen 5:59

What’s, uh, in terms of family law, what? What do you enjoy? You said you kind of fell into it. What do you enjoy most about it now that you’ve been doing it for a while?

Brad Schweiger 6:10

Really the variety and the personal the personal approach that leads to the best outcomes, I think, and just helping people when they’re coming through. And it’s the research indicates that getting the divorce and really separating from any long term relationship, I think, is one of the top three most stressful times in someone’s life. So it’s death of close you know, close friend or loved one, birth of a child, especially your first child, and the dissolution of a long term relationship, are the three highest stress periods in people’s lives, typically, in no particular order, but they’re they’re all very high stress period of time and and to have someone come in need help, um, take the time to really understand who they are as a person, um, and really the entire family dynamic. You know, everything is every single time it’s different, and every single time you’re helping someone who, um, really needs that guidance and assistance. And no case is wrote, no case is cookie cutter by any means. And I think that just keeps everything fresh, and also it kind of demands of you to not to make it stale and just take a cookie cutter approach.

Chad Franzen 7:44

When it comes to, you know, divorce scenarios, divorce cases. How do you approach, like, property, division issues?

Brad Schweiger 7:53

Well, I mean, first from the law. So in Wisconsin, there’s a presumption that once you get married, everything is open division, and so everything is divisible, and then so case law has indicated that indicates that 50/50, is a good starting point, and often the starting point for looking at how things should be divided. But there’s a number of factors that weigh into that. So you start looking at the entire picture, and this is where you look at the length of the relationship. You look at assets brought into the marriage, gifted or inherited assets can be specifically excluded from that division. So you’re trying to identify those assets. You’re looking at contributions to the marriage. And there’s complicated problems, especially if someone’s supporting someone through, like, a graduate school program or something, if one of the parties stayed at home and for like, didn’t or went to career or put the career on pause in order to raise children, some of those marital decisions that might have been made all play into a number of factors that the court is going to have to decide if the parties can’t decide for themselves. And so we start weighing those those factors in trying to craft a proposal we think is reasonable in a position that’s reasonable to either take to the other party in a good faith negotiation or maybe a mediation, or if none of those are options, or all those is failed, it’s going to be up to the judge and and you know, once you do it for a number of years and you’ve litigated or not, you usually have a range of possibilities, but sometimes that range depending on the case and What kind of assets you you’re actually dealing with, could be, you know, the range could be large of possibilities. Are there any it’s easier? Oh, go ahead, sorry, sometimes it’s easier. Sometimes you’ve got a, I had a six month marriage, and they were young parties that didn’t have anything. So that was, that’s easy.

Chad Franzen 10:00

Yeah, yeah, I can see that. Are there any like misconceptions? Do you think that are common regarding family law, regarding, you know, maybe attitude towards family law, or whatever?

Brad Schweiger 10:13

I mean, I think a common, common things we see, and maybe because it’s coming from lawyer, Google or or another source, or their, you know, their their friend’s cousin in another state that may, might, might have a different law is kids get to decide. At what age? Can kids decide where they want to be and who they want to live with? I think that’s a common misconception. I hear that a lot. I hear that I’ve heard that a lot throughout the years, and at least in Wisconsin, the kid’s voice matters, but it comes in through a guardian ad litem or another appropriate professional, and the child themselves usually doesn’t get to sit there in court and tell the judge or anyone else what they want, and it’s only one piece of the puzzle, and their voice can get louder and have more weight if they’re older and more mature. But it’s not always the case, because there’s a lot of really immature 17 year olds that are making really poor decisions for themselves in life, and then maybe they that doesn’t so it’s very, very fact specific. Just because your kid reaches a certain age doesn’t mean they get to decide. And I think that’s one of the biggest things also like marital property, that this is like a marital property state is a little bit of a misconception. Wisconsin has a presumption of division, but it’s not necessarily that well, it’s marital property state, so it’s just going to be automatically 50/50 it’s not the case. It was just 50/50 lawyers wouldn’t need to exist to litigate these things.

Chad Franzen 11:50

How do you handle child custody and placement disputes carefully?

Brad Schweiger 12:01

Well, first, first to see if there’s any agreements. Do the parties agree on anything? Sometimes they do and and that’s always nice, if the parents really know what they want to do. Even judges I’ve been in front of said, Look, you know if you’re not going to do going to decide, I’m going to decide, and I hear both the best and the worst about you and and I’m only going to see you, I’m only going to meet you for a handful of hours, probably, and I don’t know you or your family, and you know you and your family. So I think the first approach is trying to reach some agreements on those issues, if it’s possible, and the courts have certain tools that the parties can agree there’s mandatory mediation in Wisconsin, absent some exceptions, like if there’s domestic violence, and you can work with guardian ad litems, which is an attorney that specifically is appointed to represent best interest of kids. I do guardian ad litem work, as does my partner, , and The guardian ad litem will do an investigation and talk to all relevant people, maybe some collateral sources, if parties really can’t reach an agreement, there could be some custody studies where a social worker, through family court services or a private custody studies can be done, where you get a typically a social worker, another appropriate professional, doing an investigation. They really do a deep dive on family history.

Chad Franzen 13:42

What inspired you to become a guardian ad litem?

Brad Schweiger 13:46

Well, it was something I wanted to do for a number of years my prior firm, I wasn’t allowed to do it, and so when I transitioned to Richter & Phillips in August of ’21 it was an opportunity, and my partners encouraged me to do it, and it’s something I really wanted to do, because I it really is the the role in family court that you’re working right for the kids. And I think it’s a really important role, and it always seems like there’s a need for strong voices in the courtroom for kids, and it’s not always easy. Sometimes you get both parties that are both parents not happy with what you’re saying or what you’re recommending, but there really is no one else in the courtroom, and everyone thinks that they have their best best interest to their kids at heart, and sometimes they do, but sometimes those interests get a little bit skewed in the heat of litigation.

Chad Franzen 14:45

Do you enjoy that more than representing? Like one side who just comes to you and says, I need an attorney?

Brad Schweiger 14:52

I don’t I don’t know if I’d say, enjoy it more. I think it’s enjoyable in a different way. Like. Yeah, it been. It comes with its own stressors too, because I’ve taken and I’ve done like juvenile like restraining order, or what we would call injunction matters. So that’s usually with like, kids harassing other kids, or a parent, or a step parent or whoever, maybe harassing or abusing a kid, and those are, those are difficult and usually hard facts, and usually kids that are just in a bad situation. So, so there’s a certain amount of stress that comes with that, but knowing that you’re fighting, you know, fighting for the kids best interests, and looking at it from maybe a little different way than you would look at a case if you’re wearing your advocacy hat for one of the one of the parents or any other parties, is, is enjoyable. And also, I think gives, gives just a litigator, just a different perspective. Once you do a couple of those, sure, I bet.

Chad Franzen 16:01

How do you, how do you keep from, you know, I’m sure there’s a lot of lot of, like, high emotions involved in a lot of these situations, with with clients or with the people involved. You know, family matters, things like that. How do you kind of avoid getting overwhelmed by that yourself?

Brad Schweiger 16:24

I think it’s important to take appropriate breaks. And if you feel yourself getting too emotionally invested, you need to put that file down. You need to walk away for a little bit and come back. I think it’s really, really easy also to like to get wrapped up in the party’s arguments and take on and sometimes it can happen where it’s really easy to take on a personality of someone else, or take on like, their emotion and bear that yourself. And maybe it’s a really contested issue on custody or placement, or maybe it’s a financial matter and it’s support, but parties have really strong positions on what they want and what should be the right result. And attorneys are, you know, sending emails back and forth in the morning or something, and you’re you’re sitting there, and you’re thinking yourself like, you know, this is, this is wrong. This is, this is not what the law says. And it’s really easy to fire off, you know, quick email and response that maybe is not the best is draft it and set it down, and then transition to something else that’s maybe less intense in the moment, and let yourself ruminate on, on on an appropriate response before jumping back in and revisiting that email. I think for that that that letter that you’re writing, that demand letter or something that you’re writing, and I think taking that break is really important.

Chad Franzen 18:00

When you when you approach complex division issues like retirement and business divisions, do you have to take a completely different attitude or approach than you would with, you know, divorce or something like that.

Brad Schweiger 18:15

They tend to be less emotionally charged, but sometimes they are very emotionally charged, especially if it’s a longer term marriage, and someone’s taking a position that there should be a very heavily weighted um division in one party’s favor or something um. But I think, I mean, the approach is to first, is just information gathering, so some of that is a little a lot more, less emotional, kind of as like, what’s the cold, hard facts? And once we have the facts, then we can develop a position. But I think those, those issues tend to be kind of like financial those financial issues are, I think first, you’re first dealing with the analytical, and then you’re getting maybe to the root of the emotional. I think in in custody and placement issues you’re dealing with sometimes the emotional first, because it comes in charge usually, and the financial division, I think you think about it analytically first, and then if someone’s really taking a position you just, like, on the, you know, on the page. Does it make sense? Then you’d be like, Well, what’s, what’s behind this now? Like, why? Like, why does the sofa matter so much? Or, why does this account or asset, like, why is, why do they care so much about that particular asset? Maybe it was, you know, that’s the couch we got when, you know, you know, we first got married. Or that’s the couch that, you know, whatever, whatever it is, I don’t know, I don’t know. I’m stuck in a on a couch analogy.

Chad Franzen 19:54

But that’s okay. That’s a good one. One, hey, I know, as I mentioned, you’re involved. Involved in some groups, some associations and programs, the Dane County Family Law Attorneys Group, Dane County Bar Case Mediation Program, what’s kind of your role with each of those and how? How do you feel like that’s benefited you?

Brad Schweiger 20:13

Sure, like in Dane County, I’m, I’m part of a committee that’s all about legal access. So so it’s providing legal clinics for legal services to underserved populations. Veterans will clinic and a Family Law Clinic primarily. So there’s volunteers in the legal community that will come in and help people fill forums and answer questions. They don’t represent anyone in court, but they kind of set you on the right path, so they do that in the family all workshop committee that I’m on through the State Bar is that we plan a family law multi day continuing legal education program. And so we kind of, we put together put we put together an entire program, and we contact and build the speakers. Right now, I’m working with, you know, another attorney and some financial experts to put together some a program in a like, an hour and a half, or something like an hour and a half talk on, like, unique assets and how to deal with those, the tax implications, you know, the funky things that can happen, or maybe to look out for, you know, with those so we put together those, those educational programs. I also volunteer once a month with the Vera Court legal clinic, which is a clinic here in in Madison on the north side that offers kind of similar to the the Dane County committee that I’m on to individuals who are more limited means and with a very high English as a Second Language ESL population, and we have volunteer, wonderful volunteer translators that come in and help us work with a largely Spanish speaking population to navigate divorce or custody or maybe they haven’t seen their spouse in years. And how do I divorce this person now, if I can’t find them to, you know, you know, maybe it’s a driver’s license or a small personal injury claim, we’ve we’ve had walk in the door all sorts of stuff that, you know, they really have nowhere else to go, and they can’t afford an attorney, and so we we start them there, fill out the forms, point them in the right direction, help them navigate the system. And oftentimes we still find that some forms we can’t even aren’t even still offered in Spanish. So it’s trying to trying to trying to try and explain those to them and help them fill them out if they can’t, if they can’t read it in their native language.

Chad Franzen 23:05

Yeah, yeah. How did your, how did your partnership with Richter & Phillips come about?

Brad Schweiger 23:12

That was through kind of, kind of organically, through I had known both of them throughout the years, and we’ve had cases together. I was looking to make a transition for my other firm, and there was an introduction, and we had some meetings, um, and really made sure it was good fit and a good feel. Um, so I think it it came about slowly, then quickly, over the course of a few months.

Chad Franzen 23:45

Sure what? I have one more question for you, but I guess just tell me how people can find out more about Richter & Phillips.

Brad Schweiger 23:52

Well, he can Google us, Richter & Phillips, and look at our website, and that’s probably the main way we’re all on Avvo as well. I know my partners also do family law. My partner, Ashley Richter, also does some wills and simple estate planning. She also does adoption, which there’s not, you know, only probably a handful of attorneys in Madison, Wisconsin that really focus in on adoption. So she does adoptions as well. She does her guardian item work, and my other partner, Megan Phillips. In addition, she has a substantial, a substantial portion of her practice is doing like licensure defense. So defending professionals who might you know, be in having their their professional licenses threatened, and defending them and the administrative hearings that have have to happen when that occurs. So that’s a pretty large area for focus, and it’s really that’s kind of a niche area as well. So we do have. Kind of a diverse area of practice. And it’s not just a family law firm we have. We branch out. We do. She does also a little bit of civil litigation as well.

Chad Franzen 25:08

Last question for you, what if you have meet somebody that you knew, or you knew somebody who happened to meet somebody who was just graduating law school and wanted to go into family law, what advice would you tell them, based on you’ve done it that you know they couldn’t learn in law school. You’ve just done it.

Brad Schweiger 25:27

Yeah? Advice to just getting into family law first, make sure that you know what you’re getting into. Reach out, reach out to family law firms and try to get in for like, a clerkship, if they haven’t already, to really get their their boots on the ground to make sure they like it. It is. It could be a very high stress area of the law. But if you like something that’s faster paced, and if you like something that’s going to put you in the courtroom real quick, a lot of other a lot of other places, the Aries, the law, you might be not see a courtroom for years, and then not even first chair trial. You want a first chair trial real quick. Come into family law if you want. And that’s your drive, and that’s your passion.

Chad Franzen 26:09

Do you particularly enjoy, you know, doing courtroom work?

Brad Schweiger 26:14

Yes, I think you have to, if you want, if you want to have any longevity, you have to, you have to, you have to know and have to want to be in the courtroom, alright, it’s not, I always say it’s not my first option. But if we gotta go, we gotta go.

Chad Franzen 26:29

Yeah, yeah, of course. Hey, Brad, it’s been great to talk to you. Thank you so much for your time and all of your insights and your good advice and your thanks so much. Really appreciate it.

Brad Schweiger 26:40

Yeah, thanks, Chad.

Chad Franzen 26:41

So long everybody.

Outro 26:45

Thanks for listening to 15 Minutes. Be sure to subscribe and we’ll see you next time.