Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:

• [1:52] Diane Camacho’s journey from high school legal secretary to founding DLC Consulting Services
• [5:03] Common challenges attorneys face in balancing practicing law with business operations
• [6:31] Implementing technology to improve law firm efficiency
• [7:59] Diane’s advice for lawyers looking to optimize their practice management strategies
• [11:27] How Diane’s teaching practice influences her consultancy work
• [14:22] The impact of remote and virtual collaboration in law firms
• [18:45] Why Diane believes every aspiring legal manager must take accounting classes

In this episode…

Running a small law firm comes with unique challenges, from managing operations to maintaining efficiency with limited resources. How can small law firms achieve operational excellence in an increasingly competitive environment?

According to Diane Camacho, a legal management consultant with over 35 years of experience, the key lies in strategically using technology and streamlining processes. She highlights the importance of understanding and fully utilizing existing software to reduce inefficiencies. Additionally, Diane emphasizes the need for small firms to focus on their core strengths while outsourcing or automating non-essential tasks. By doing so, small law firms can enhance their operational efficiency, allowing them to compete effectively and grow sustainably.

In this episode of 15 Minutes, host Chad Franzen sits down with Diane Camacho, Founder, President, and CEO of DLC Consulting Services, to discuss how small law firms can achieve operational excellence. They explore the importance of technology in optimizing law firm operations, the critical role of streamlining processes, and practical strategies for managing growth while minimizing stress.

Resources mentioned in this episode:

• Chad Franzen on LinkedIn
• Gladiator Law Marketing
• Diane Camacho: LinkedIn | Email
• DLC Consulting Services

Special Mentions

• San Francisco State University
• Association of Legal Administrators (ALA)

Quotable Moments

• “There was a gap in the market, and I like small firms better.”
• “You have to know the financial workings of a law firm to be effective.”
• “Stressing about your law firm’s operations can keep you up at night, which is where we step in to ease the burden.”
• “Every time we enable a firm to start billing at their new office immediately, it’s a moment of pride for us.”
• “Managing a law firm hasn’t evolved much, but the practice of law definitely has.”

Action Steps

1. Assess and streamline your firm’s billing and collections processes: Doing so will allow you to collect fees more efficiently and enhance overall profitability.
2. Implement and fully utilize law practice management software and its latest capabilities: Boosting software use can help to overcome staff shortages and keep firms up-to-date with current features.
3. Move to cloud-based systems if appropriate, but conduct thorough research on software compatibility and sophistication: It is important to stay abreast of evolving technology while exercising discernment in evaluating sales pitches.
4. Redesign workspace usage to adapt to remote work realities, considering hoteling and shared office spaces: Adapting to remote work trends is crucial for downsizing office footprints and staying relevant in today’s legal practice environment.
5. Engage in continuous financial management education: Law firm management requires a firm understanding of the financial aspects of the business, which helps to streamline operations and ensure the long-term success of your firm.

Sponsor for this episode…

This episode is brought to you by Gladiator Law Marketing, where we deliver tailor-made services to help you accomplish your objectives and maximize your growth potential.

To have a successful marketing campaign and make sure you’re getting the best ROI, your firm needs to have a better website and better content. At Gladiator Law Marketing, we use artificial intelligence, machine learning, and decades of experience to outperform the competition.

To learn more, go to gladiatorlawmarketing.com or schedule a free marketing consultation. You can also send an email to adam@gladiatorlawmarketing.com.

Episode Transcript

Intro  0:01

You’re listening to 15 Minutes where we feature community leaders sharing what the rest of us should know but likely don’t.

Chad Franzen  0:12

Hi. Chad Franzen, here one of the hosts of Share Your Voice, where we talk with top notch law firms and lawyers about what it takes to grow a successful law practice. This episode is brought to you by Gladiator Law Marketing, delivering tailor made services to help you accomplish your objectives and maximize your growth potential to have a successful marketing campaign and make sure you’re getting the best ROI your firm needs to have a better website and better content. Gladiator Law Marketing uses artificial intelligence, machine learning and decades of experience to outperform the competition to learn more, go to gladiatorlawmarketing.com, where you can schedule a free marketing consultation. My guest today is Diane Camacho, the Founder of DLC Consulting Services. With over 25 years of experience as a legal manager in San Francisco across firms of various sizes, Diane established DLC Consulting Services in 2013. Her consultancy work focuses on assisting small firms nationwide. With a diverse range of management and operational challenges as a Certified Legal Manager, Diane’s expertise extends to areas such as operations, IOLTA accounting, and legal practice management software. She also imparts her knowledge by teaching law office management at San Francisco State University. Diane’s commitment to enhancing efficiency within the legal community is evident through her extensive involvement, including over 15 years on the board of directors for the San Francisco chapter of the Association of Legal Administrators. Diane, thanks so much for joining me today. How are you?

Diane Camacho  1:39 

I’m good. Thank you very much for having me. I appreciate it, Chad.

Chad Franzen  1:43

Sure, yeah, it’s great to have you. So take me through kind of your professional journey up until the point you established DLC Consulting Services.

Diane Camacho  1:52

Well, when I was in high school, it was, how can you earn enough money to get out of your parents house? So it was a very different time. So I actually started with a legal secretary class in high school through the regional occupation program. And so that’s my mother was a legal secretary and became a legal manager, and I understood that it would be a good career. So that’s kind of how I started, and then through various different positions, from the DAs office in Oakland to managing a an engineering firm, to getting into a secretarial position at a law firm and then becoming their branch office manager, And then working through all different kinds of jobs up until 2013 and sure, most of it was managing within law firms.

Chad Franzen  2:48

So what? How did your experience as a legal manager then shape your decision to establish DLC Consulting Services? And how did that kind of you know, come about?

Diane Camacho  2:58

Well, I knew that there was a need for small firms who couldn’t necessarily afford someone like us or didn’t need somebody like us full time. So they didn’t need somebody at our level, but they needed that expertise to help them and to guide them. So I always knew that there was a market, and then in 2013 I decided, instead of looking for a new job, after one job finished, I would try this for a year and then another year. Like, like many entrepreneurs, it’s like, Okay, I’ll try it for a year and see how it goes. And it was 10 years in September. So that’s kind of how I got into it. Now it’s very it’s evolved again, like law firms, like any small business, it’s evolved, and currently I have myself and two other consultants that are very have very similar backgrounds to myself, and we do all kinds of things for law firms, from helping attorneys leaving law firms open up their law firms, new new businesses, to identifying problem areas in law firms that need to be restructured, or procedures put in place. Or, you know, it could be anything from staffing to the software to training that needs to be focused on.

Chad Franzen  4:20

Was it the so what motivated your focus on helping small law firms with management and operational issues? Was it just you saw there was a need, like a kind of a gap in the market, or was it? Was it something beyond that?

Diane Camacho  4:34

It was a gap in the market, and I like I like small firms better. I’ve worked in large firms, and the bureaucracy is really hard for me. So working with small firms, I was able to, you know, work with the owners and and really help them and and give them some relief in the stress.

Chad Franzen  4:51

What I guess, let’s, let’s get into some of the things you do. Then, what are some common challenges that attorneys face when it comes to, you know, practicing law as opposed to running their own bureau.

Diane Camacho  5:03

Well, I think that whenever you’re looking at the business side of things, attorneys, they could learn how to do it, and many do, but it’s not the best use of their time, and they don’t have the the experience to have worked with you know law firms across the country, and know what’s happening in the software market, and know what the staffing ratios are in other firms, and understand what is possible with their software because they haven’t seen it, or what even what the laws are in their state to exempt or non exempt employees, and how you do that. They’re oftentimes really focused on where they are and what they do there, and what they’ve always done there, versus what are the possibilities, what’s out there? How can we do this differently and more efficiently? We all know we can’t find employees. Everybody across the country is looking for experienced attorneys, experienced paralegals, experienced accounting people. There’s just a there’s just a dearth of that kind of skill. So there has to be a way to be more efficient with less staff. It’s not that law firms are like reducing staff. It’s they can’t find a staff.

Chad Franzen  6:23

What are there some, maybe some technology implementations that can improve efficiency within law firms?

Diane Camacho  6:31 

Oh, absolutely. Many times it is the it is they have the technology and they’re not using it because they only use what they know how to use, so they don’t know a lot of the different things that even the changes that have happened with their own software, right? It’s constantly updating. I mean, look at Outlook. You know, we constantly get a new outlook. Well, all the software is evolving like that, and if you don’t stay on top of it, then you’re, you don’t know what the new features are that can help you, and it’s very hard to stay on top of it. So that is one of the ways a lot of people are getting off of the server based systems and moving into the cloud. Some of them have been in very, very sophisticated software programs on a server, and they want to go to the cloud, but the cloud software isn’t that sophisticated yet, and a lot of the software companies are really pushing sales that are inappropriate, that they should not be pushing.

Chad Franzen  7:35

So there’s a, oh, I’m sorry, go ahead.

Diane Camacho  7:37

No, that’s all I’m going to say.

Chad Franzen  7:41

So let’s say an attorney, you know, maybe an attorney is listening to this and is like, I’m a good lawyer, but I’m in over my head with a lot of the project management and things like that. What is there kind of some beginning advice you give to lawyers looking to optimize their project their practice management strategies?

Diane Camacho  7:59

Well, usually we would go in and do what we call an assessment. So we’d go in and really see what they’re doing. We would talk to people, we would look at their systems, look at their finances, and we’d really say, Okay, from client intake to completing a matter what your process, who’s touching it? What are you touching? And then we can go in and say, well, it really is. You can be more efficient with your billing, or you can really do more document automation, or your intake is really cumbersome, so kind of looking at where their process needs to be streamlined. So it’s not a we aren’t this is the box, and you need to go in the box, and this is how you fit into our box. We’re really customized. We’ve all worked for small firms, and they’re all different, so you need to figure out what they need before you make recommendations.

Chad Franzen  8:47

What are some key elements you consider when you help with office build outs and moves.

Diane Camacho  8:52

Build outs and moves, I think that looking at the people that are really going to be hoteling, in a sense, and whether you know there needs to be a kind of a culture change that if you’re only going to be in the office two days a week, you don’t get your own office. You can come in every day and get your own office, but if you only want to come in a couple days, you’re going to have to share and it’s going to be kind of a blank office that you can go into and plug in your computer. That’s something that is happening a lot more and when the firms reduce their footprint, but it’s really a hard it’s a hard sell for some people that that want their own space when they come to the office, but you have to give and take. So that’s something that really needs to be considered, and is really important right now with build outs and moves, a lot of reduction in space, a lot of giving away furniture, no more libraries, those kinds of things.

Chad Franzen  9:49

Is there an approach or a strategy that you found to be most effective in enhancing attorney productivity within their practice?

Diane Camacho  9:58

Normally, it is. Just, you know, first looking at their finances and finding where there are areas for improvement. Maybe it’s, you know, they’re writing off too much time, or their AR is too long, and you need to get that money in. Because it’s all about, you know, making sure that you can collect your dog dollar. And then it’s really looking at the software, what they have, and how they can utilize that software. So it’s really starts basically with billing and collections and how you do that, and if that’s efficient and it’s effective, and then it goes into, how do you create your product? How do you create your documents, or your you know, whatever it happens to be that you’re delivering. How are you doing that? And is there an easier way to do it, less people involved, and less touch points? And how can we help you do that?

Chad Franzen  10:49 

Is there a so you know, you started DLCCS In 2013 is there a moment or a story like maybe a client that you look back on, that you’re particularly proud of in terms of the impact that you made on their operations.

Diane Camacho  11:04 

I think every time we open a new law firm, and they are they leave their office their firm on Friday and can start billing at their new firm on Monday, which is our ideal, that it makes us very proud and and we’ve done that across the country multiple times. So I think that that is, that’s probably what I’m most proud of.

Chad Franzen  11:27 

How has your, you know, I mentioned that you teach law office management in San Francisco. Has that influenced your consultancy work? And if so, how?

Diane Camacho  11:37

I think that it’s made me look at all the different areas. And really, because you have to focus on different areas when you’re teaching different you know, there’s there’s operations, finance, HR and leadership is kind of what those those things are, is understanding how much everything touches everything, and how intertwined the success of those different areas is that’s kind of honed in on that, you know it, but then when you’re teaching it, you can say, well, this affects this over here, and this affects that over there.

Chad Franzen  12:15

How do you maintain a balance between kind of staying current with maybe the industry, industry trends, while also providing, you know, good consultancy services?

Diane Camacho  12:23

Never assuming what I know is is the right thing right now, and always doing the research again. So when we’re looking for software, we research software, you know, every time and see if this is if our recommendation last time is the best and most current recommendation this time it’s again, not having a box, and then it kind of forces you to stay current. And being involved in the bar associations, I have two other consultants. Also, we’re all very, very connected in the legal community and our environments, and so we get a lot of notifications that this has changed. That has changed staying current with my certification, so it requires you know, learning and training like a bar, like a licensed bar, license.

Chad Franzen  13:13

What has your experience as an entrepreneur with DLCCS helped you in terms of the advice that you give to attorneys, or is it is a different ballpark.

Diane Camacho  13:26

I think it helps and it helps me understand and have empathy for what’s going on for them. When we start a law firm, we start talking to somebody about a law firm, we do a very detailed pro forma budget. I never did that. Probably should have, I might have, you know, made some different choices in the beginning, but that is something that I learned. I wish I would have done, and now it’s kind of a requirement for us, being, you know, being systematic in what you’re doing and making sure things are documented so that you can have somebody else do it and help you when you’re growing. That’s been really important too, but I think that it’s having the the the connection with the owners, and understanding as an owner, what it’s like at night when you you don’t know if you’re going to make payroll.

Chad Franzen  14:13

How do you see the impact of remote and virtual collaboration shaping the future of law firm operations? Or has it already?

Diane Camacho  14:22

I think it has already. I think that when we’re doing the virtual and the remote, we need to figure out how to continue to have a connection with the people that we are not in the same room with. And there are a lot of different ways and a lot of different things that work. But in legal it’s very difficult for young folks or new attorneys and new paralegals to get the training they need remotely. And that that is an issue that really needs to be addressed, I think, in the community, because the way that attorneys learn how to. An attorney is in the law firm. They don’t learn it from law school, right? We all know that they learn it from being in the office and talking to someone and getting instructions from somewhere. And partners tend to distribute work to people they know and trust. And if you’ve been a zoom, if you’ve been on zoom with them for, you know, four months or five months, and they really haven’t made a connection, because it’s a group zoom, they very likely are not going to give you work. And people need to understand that, and they need to modify their behavior, at least in the beginning, so that they make personal connection with the attorneys in their office, just like the clients want personal attention. You know, with the attorneys.

Chad Franzen  15:47  

What have you found to be the most enjoyable, slash rewarding thing about being a legal manager or being a consultant? You know, same basic thing or being a consultant?

Diane Camacho  15:57

Helping firm owners relieve stress. Having them going, Oh, thank you. Just talking to you makes me feel better. That is really what I want to be able to do.

Chad Franzen  16:12

Do you see that a lot of the people that you work with either are under stress or now, once they’ve talked to you, they realize, Oh yeah, it would be a lot less stressful for me if I did this.

Diane Camacho  16:24

Most people don’t come to us unless they’re under a lot of stress. Gotcha, people come to us when they hit the wall, when something isn’t working, when they’ve lost a key employee and they’re not sure what to do and how to reassign or re restructure things they’ve just become a managing partner, and the senior partners have retired, and the more junior partners are now leading the firm, and they want to do things everything differently. So how do we do that without causing a lot of disruption? Causes disruption, but.

Chad Franzen  16:59

Is there a maybe a most common kind of frustration that attorneys have that they didn’t realize that they were going to face when they decided to open up their own business. Or does it vary from lawyer to lawyer?

Diane Camacho  17:12

I think it’s always surprising as a leader, when you are leading people and things come up that you never would have expected or you thought other people had to deal with, and then they come in and sit down in your office and you have this situation. It could be anything that all of a sudden, uh, oh, what am I supposed to do with this? I think that is very surprising to a lot of people.

Chad Franzen  17:35

Has the role of a legal manager evolves since you’ve been a part of it. And do you see it continuing? Do you see it evolving in the future?

Diane Camacho  17:45

I don’t think it’s evolved. I think that the practice of law has evolved, but I don’t think that managing the business of law has evolved. You have the same areas, you have the same KPIs, you have the same you know, people problems, software is constantly changing. You know, from the typewriter to what we’re doing now, that’s been a constant change for the last 35 years. So I think that the practice of law has changed. I don’t think that managing it has changed.

Chad Franzen  18:16

I have one more question for you, but first, tell me how people can find out more about DLC Consulting Services.

Diane Camacho  18:21

Thank you. Thank you. We are at dlccs.com and my email is diane@dlccs.com

Chad Franzen  18:31

So my last question for you. You know, if there are people out there who are kind of aspiring legal managers, what could you what advice could you give them based solely on your experience that they wouldn’t learn in training or in school?

Diane Camacho  18:45

Take accounting classes, understand finance. That’s the most difficult people, difficult area, and it’s the most lacking. Sometimes in the overall legal manager, they have a good HR background, or they have, you know, an IT background, but you have to have, you have to know the financial workings of a law firm to be effective.

Chad Franzen  19:09

Okay, hey, Diane, it’s been great. So it’s been great to talk to you. Thank you so much for your time and all of your insights, really interesting and informative. I really appreciate it.

Diane Camacho  19:15

Thank you. Thank you for having me, Chad.

Chad Franzen  19:17

Thank you. So long, everybody.

Outro  19:22 

Thanks for listening to 15 Minutes. Be sure to subscribe and we’ll see you next time.